Is Sellier and Bellot clean ammo?

All I was after was a brand of 115 practice ammo that I won’t be sorry I bought. All my striker springs are Glock OEM.

I always search for clean ammo vs cost of ammo. I may pay a penny or two extra for cleaner ammo. I like Fiocchi

What do you mean by clean?

What do you mean by clean?

Clean as in not dirty. S&B is dirty, reman is dirty, pmc is dirty. Fiocchi is cleaner running as in less crap to inhale, ingest, cause breathing issues.

What is “hard” or “soft” about a primer? The actual metal in the middle...??? Do you mean the difference between steel and a marshmallow?

'Harder', simply as in 'made from harder metal', which means it takes a more forceful impact or strike to set it off.

Rifle primers are generally made from harder metal than pistol primers, since they usually have to stand up to higher chamber pressures. Even in the same type of primer, some manufacturers are softer or harder in nature. That's why Lee (and possibly other mfrs, not sure) recommend against using certain, soft, brands of primers in their loading machines.

Clean as in not dirty. S&B is dirty, reman is dirty, pmc is dirty. Fiocchi is cleaner running as in less crap to inhale, ingest, cause breathing issues.

That's a fact - and for that matter, why does PMC always smell like their powder is 30% cat urine...?

That's a fact - and for that matter, why does PMC always smell like their powder is 30% cat urine...?

Agreed!

Interestingly, I just noticed in a pic I posted in another thread, the ammo I shot this weekend was S&B.

You can see in the moon clip, the S&B headstamp:

Other than being a little dirty, no problems at all...

What is “hard” or “soft” about a primer? The actual metal in the middle...??? Do you mean the difference between steel and a marshmallow?

Not nearly as much as steel versus marshmallows, more like a fresh marshmallow versus a stale one. Federals are far and away the softest primer out there, and that is why all the wheel gunners (revolver shooters) prefer them. Most brands are fairly close in hardness, CCI, WW, RP, Fiocchi, but definelty Tula is much harder, along with S&B, and to run 100% in a Glock, I use a 6lb firing pin spring.

Rifle primers are "harder" for 2 reasons. M1 Garrands, M14's, AR-15's/AR-10's, also SKS and AR varients, well pretty much all semi auto military rifles, have floating firing pins to make things simple (but with the risk of slam fire). So what happens is they dink the primer upon loading. That is enough force to set off the softer pistol primers (because I tried it with Federals!). Also because rifle pressures are way above pistol at around 75Ksi (I seen plenty of blown primers in AR's) and you can get noticeable primer flow. Now you can sometimes get by using rifle primer in your pistol loads if you have stout enough springs (during the last great primer powder shortage...) I ended up using magnum primers instead.

Never heard anything about not using soft primers on a Lee press in 50 years of loading, there is nothing different about a Lee press, but then I have never used a Lee anything (except for their collet crimp die for .357SIG because it saves the trimming step). I have even punched out upside down primers and squashed them sideways. They have to be hit pretty square.

Not nearly as much as steel versus marshmallows, more like a fresh marshmallow versus a stale one. Federals are far and away the softest primer out there, and that is why all the wheel gunners (revolver shooters) prefer them. Most brands are fairly close in hardness, CCI, WW, RP, Fiocchi, but definelty Tula is much harder, along with S&B, and to run 100% in a Glock, I use a 6lb firing pin spring.

Rifle primers are "harder" for 2 reasons. M1 Garrands, M14's, AR-15's/AR-10's, also SKS and AR varients, well pretty much all semi auto military rifles, have floating firing pins to make things simple (but with the risk of slam fire). So what happens is they dink the primer upon loading. That is enough force to set off the softer pistol primers (because I tried it with Federals!). Also because rifle pressures are way above pistol at around 75Ksi (I seen plenty of blown primers in AR's) and you can get noticeable primer flow. Now you can sometimes get by using rifle primer in your pistol loads if you have stout enough springs (during the last great primer powder shortage...) I ended up using magnum primers instead.

Never heard anything about not using soft primers on a Lee press in 50 years of loading, there is nothing different about a Lee press, but then I have never used a Lee anything (except for their collet crimp die for .357SIG because it saves the trimming step). I have even punched out upside down primers and squashed them sideways. They have to be hit pretty square.

Six, thanks for the clear, concise explanation. Much appreciated.

...Never heard anything about not using soft primers on a Lee press in 50 years of loading, there is nothing different about a Lee press, but then I have never used a Lee anything (except for their collet crimp die for .357SIG because it saves the trimming step). I have even punched out upside down primers and squashed them sideways. They have to be hit pretty square.

In what I assume is a case of lawyer-itis, on Page 1 of the Pro-1000 manual it states:

Use only Remington™ or CCI™ primers. Other brands like Federal™, can explode with sufficient force to seriously injure the user or persons nearby.

https://leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/TR2441.pdf

I use Remington, Federal, Winchester and CCI, and have never had a problem. Just passing along what Lee's instructions say.

I didn't watch the whole video, but went to the 24:58 mark you referenced, where he says this about S&B stuff:
"...it's absolutely dog**** ammunition. But I buy it because out of 50 rounds I'm going to get two or three failures to fire, so I'm getting my real, full-power malfunction reps."

Either he's exaggerating or there's something wrong with his gun. I can't think of a single malfunction with S&B ammo in either pistol or rifle. I can't swear that there hasn't been one at some time or other, but it's certainly not a common thing at all. They do use harder primers than most american mfrs do, but that's common among european ammo makers.

So either he got hold of a flukish bad batch, or his gun is malfunctioning in some way. S&B, Fiocchi, WW/USA, American Eagle, even Blazer and probably several others have been fine for me for a long time.

I've shot a few cases (case = 1000 rounds) of 9MM and .45 ammo and cannot recall any failures to fire. I'm with John...this guy may have something wrong with his firearm. I don't know.

As far as S&B running "dirty", well, that's kinda subjective. All guns get dirty, and no ammo (beyond air guns) runs clean. The only ammo I found to really run "dirty" where I got crap on my hands was Freedom Munitions, especially their .45 ACP ammo, and it didn't matter if I ran reman or new.

From customer reviews on S&B 115gr 9MM at sgammo.com

https://www.sgammo.com/product/sell...-luger-sellier-bellot-124-grain-fmj-ammo-sb9b

"Customer Reviews
by Anonymous - 2018-12-19 21:31
Over 10k rounds of the 115gr without a hiccup in all my Glocks and AR9. Won’t buy anything else. Love this Ammo.
by shadetreeaz - 2018-09-21 18:01
Excellent quality and price. Burns clean and no failures of any kind in any of my 3 different brand 9mm's. Consistent accuracy throughout case. Top quality brass fully re-loadable if you're into that. I give it to a friend who is and he says it's as good as anything he can buy.
by Anonymous - 2018-04-26 00:59
I prefer 124gr because it's similar to my carry ammo, and boy does my CZ-75 love this stuff. I've goon through about 2000 rounds between my Xdm, Xds, CZ-75 SP01, P10c, and M&P. Not once have I had any failures. I'm thoroughly pleased and I'm definitely stocking up on this.
by david.dumas - 2017-11-18 16:39
This is great food for your machine gun! It is super clean, consistent, and reliable. At this price, I've completely stopped buying the steel case ammo and only buy this stuff. I hope it is back in stock soon so I can buy more!
by Anonymous - 2017-05-05 08:40
This S&B ammo, SB9B, is good quality ammo. It shoots cleaner than most. I produced consistent groups from a variety of pistols. I also like S&B's smaller, tighter packed boxes which are easier to store because they take up less space. Shipped fast with tracking. I'll buy again."

Dang, thanks for posting that. Enlightening video!

I’ve now shot 3,000 rounds of Fiocchi 115 ball. I can say that it runs much cleaner. It will be all I run from now on. Unless you guys buy it all before me.

I’ve now shot 3,000 rounds of Fiocchi 115 ball. I can say that it runs much cleaner. It will be all I run from now on. Unless you guys buy it all before me.

I’ve heard nothing but good things about Fiocci ammo. It’s also John Lovell’s ammo of choice. Bang on, Jim!

Anyone chronographed Fiocchi stuff? I've run a fair amount of it with no problems, but never clocked any of it except their 158-grain stuff; which was very slow.

Obviously the 158's are going to be subsonic with that heavy a bullet, but it's WAY subsonic. Runs only 818fps even from my full-size M&P and just 734 from the little Kahr, where most subsonic stuff runs 150-200 fps faster than that. Even from the carbine it only runs 907 fps, the slowest by far even among subsonics. It does make a nice round for introducing new shooters to the caliber since the recoil is so weak.

Just wondering how their more normal-weight loads do.

It feels hotter than other range ammo. I just ordered another 3,000 rounds of Fiocchi 124 grain ball. I am leaning towards the 124 grain range over the 115 grain range. I like the holes it makes in the target more.

Anyone chronographed Fiocchi stuff? I've run a fair amount of it with no problems, but never clocked any of it except their 158-grain stuff; which was very slow.

Obviously the 158's are going to be subsonic with that heavy a bullet, but it's WAY subsonic. Runs only 818fps even from my full-size M&P and just 734 from the little Kahr, where most subsonic stuff runs 150-200 fps faster than that. Even from the carbine it only runs 907 fps, the slowest by far even among subsonics. It does make a nice round for introducing new shooters to the caliber since the recoil is so weak.

Just wondering how their more normal-weight loads do.